Ever seen the old knob & tube wiring of the 1880s - 1930s?

[Vince]

I found this interesting article about knob & tube wiring that were used from the earliest days of electricity to well into the 20th century. Take a look, it's fascinating! The article even has several pictures, including one of a socket!

Knob & tube wiring on Wikipedia .

[FGS]

Oh, yeah. My brother's place has the wiring like the one on Wiki. Scary but if the building's still standing after 80 years then the wiring are still safe to use. Though not able to meet current energy demands today.

[Vince]

Some older wirings are still acceptable today, but knob & tube wiring is way too old, it dates even before any electrical code existed, so there may be flaws that are dangerous (like the solder and tape instead of wire nuts).  On the wiki the light socket pictured could be dangerous because connections are exposed (no metallic box).

Newer wiring are safer. For example, my house dates from 1978 and most of the cables used are rubber-covered, however they are Romex cable, so I'd just need to replace the cables in the future.

[Jace the Gull]

My grandma's house was built in 1952....the wiring is mostly consist of metalic sheathed armor wires WITHOUT grounding....however the metal sheathed can be substituted as a grounding, Junction boxes were already used at that time. in some rooms have the older 2 prong outlets there are also a lot fewer outlets so my grandpa from time to time had added some outlets on the molding of floor (external outlet kits which I have one I can post...) and regular rental cord nailed to the moldings and those new additions are simply plugged into the existing wall outlets......

Alright, I am not exactly sure what Ian thinks, but as for me and when I formally administrated another lighting page, this was not a lighting related topic, although without this we would not power lights. But again this was posted by a sub admin like me. Perhaps this topic is much better suited for the following page

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Utilitystuffhobby/

I posted a lot of pictures of older switches in this webpage....there was over 30 new uploads by me and a few members including Mister Lay (Dave L.) at the same time and Mister Lay posted some cool sound clips on the pages...plus.....I discovered that one of my switches according to Mister Lay was a rare one! Also in this group page you would be welcome to post wiring you find and all that sorts since it is Utility related, what do you guys think?

[lightman64]

O yeah! My Sunday School teacher's house is from the 1930's and it has K&T wiring. Pretty scary stuff, wouldn't wanna buy a house that still has it!
Afraid something like on The Money Pit would happen!  

[joe_347V]

I haven't seen knob and tube wiring before in real life but I 've seen a display of knob and tube wiring before at a electrical display.  It's kind of scary to see something as old as K&T still being used today especially since there weren't as many circuits and there was no grounding in K&T

Here's a picture of a display of K&T wiring(Click to enlarge):


 

[SeanB~1]

I did see some that was removed from the hotel next door, I did post a photo of it.

[gailgrove]

I`ve seen it in a house that was about to be demolished (I was going to get a knob and tube) but they showed up too early in the morning  :

[icefoglights]

A house I lived in while I was in Louisiana had K&T wiring.  I ended up replacing most of it.  The parts of it that hadn't been messed with too much were actually in good shape, despite brittle and missing insulation on the wires.  The worst stuff was where the wiring had been messed with over the years, with balls of open splices made sitting on top of the ceiling.

That house had almost all major generations of wiring in it.  The front had knob and tube dating from its original construction.  The back half, which was added later, had a early type of cable.  Basically the same wires used in k&t wrapped in paper and bundled in a thick loom sheath, with both wires the same color.  Than there was "loomex" cable with rubber/vinyl insulated colored wires wrapped in paper and bundled in a thin loom sheath.  Than there was ungrounded romex; same construction as loomex but with the sheeth made from vinyl, and finally grounded romex.

[Nevada Willis]

I grew up in K&T houses.  As a tot I once climbed up and pulled a brass pendant light fixture off the K&T braid that it was hanging from with a shower of sparks that followed.  Never did that again.  Electric meters were indoors which was no problem since most ladies stayed at home back then.  If you were gone on meter reading day you had a little card to put in the window with numbered wheels that you'd turn to match the readout of the meter.

The original electrical outlets were actually Edison sockets.  Old lamps had threaded bases at the ends of their cords that screwed into the sockets.  Those little two hole screw in socket adapters were originally made to adapt the old screw in outlets to the new fangled blade type plugs.

Having actually worked with K&T as I got older I appreciated the skill used to tension and turn the wiring so it would remain taught.  The up side to K&T was that it dissipated heat really well so it could carry a pretty good load.  The down side was that as the insulation wore down, you could get a really sharp "bite" from it if you rubbed up against it.

An outfit called Radio Daze still makes replacement fabric coated wire and some buildings in historic districts still have K&T showing, although I would imagine that most of their loads were carried behind the walls in Romex and conduit.

":O) Willis

[Jace the Gull]

Man that is awesome! Thank you for sharing this....I did suspect about the edision screw wall outlets...but never actually saw an actual one nor a picture of one...Although I have a replica of an old catalog and the appliance has shown Edison bases on the ends of the wires

Do you know roughly when did they come out with regular outlets with 2 holes (minus grounding?)

I saw your webpage and was SOOO impressed with your collection and the streetlights and all.....and decided to invite you here!

Welcome to Galleryoflights.org

I and the members in this webpage collects streetlights, bulbs, old electrical stuff, starters, and all sorts of things! I really hope you will enjoy this page!!!

[rjluna2]

You can still use the modern wiring through or around the old knob and still serves purpose

[Nevada Willis]

OK, here's the history as I know it.

Edison invented the Edison base (or Edison Screw) and Mazda patented it.  Around 1904 Hubbell patented the blade type recepticle / plug system.  Here's where things got weird.

Some electric companies charged different rates for lighting and appliances, lighting costing less.  Prior to large dynamos providing electricity, motors and heating elements such as toasters put a pretty good load on the system.  So in some areas buildings were wired for light and also separately for appliances.

Light receptacles used Edison screw connections and appliance receptacles used Hubbell blade receptacles.  Wall outlets for table lamps had Edison screw sockets.  Outlets for toasters in the kitchen, for example, were Hubbell blades.

Only one problem.  For a few cents folks could go out and buy Edison to Hubbell adapters and beat the system.  So by around 1915 the electric rates were standardized and pretty much all new receptacles were the Hubbell blade type.

[Jace the Gull]

Wow amazing! When did polarized outlets come out? I have seen pretty old ones have them already.......Also got any good information about grounding and when did they come out? I know Grounding became standard and must be used in all places by 1962-1963...

[Vince]

Welcome to Gallery Of Lights! 

I think you have a YouTube account right? If I'm right, you also seem to have a lot of knowledge about traffic lights (and also electric systems as I can see!). Hope you'll enjoy the site!

Best regards,

Vince.